quote:

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Originally posted by lukemercier

I think most department stores will only reissue an in-store-credit. Deering is a mass production company that can afford to refund in full. The little guy relies on the sale to feed his family and pay the rent.

You’re comparing apples to oranges here.


Luke Mercier

Luke Mercier Handmade Violins & Banjos
www.lukemercier.com


 

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So many things wrong with this guys post, but I'll just comment on the funniest part.  Apparently Deering can do the right thing by refunding because they are a bigger company, and Luke can't because he's a small builder.  I didn't realize that ethics were dictated by the size of the business....hahahahaha.  Who knew?

That is all.

Tim

Woke up this morning to my wife giving me heck for stooping as low as to throw out insults (and for spelling mistakes!).

My sincere apologies for the unnecessary rant towards BHO and some of its members.

I do regret some of the things I wrote but I do and always will, stand behind my work.

This was not a misaligned neck!

commission or not if the customer isn't happy with the product and you got it back you need to send a full refund. It shows professionalism and good faith. and you will end up getting your money for the banjo eventually if it is a decent instrument and then your reputation will not be trashed all over the world! thanks to the internet.

 I know you need to make money and pay bills but not at the expense of others who are unhappy with your work, how can you maintain your self esteem when your customers who spent their hard earned money are not happy with what you sent them.

I have had a banjo that was messed up from a small builder and he did all he could to make me happy and didn't worry about his time or cost, thats how an honerable shop does business and avoids a bad reputation. Try it, it works!

Chris

Didn't realize the topic was still active.
Recently watched North American Banjo Builders by Craig Evans. Just a wonderful
group of professional bulders who stand behind their work. Unfortunately my
experience with Luke Mercier was 'heartbreak' banjo. Hopefully my post will not
harm all the small banjo builders who are responsible guys (and maybe gals)
who build quality banjos and stand behind their work.
Love to all of you who post and contribute their music and advice to make
BanjoHangout a great home to all us.

It's standard at manyl, if not most, businesses that custom orders are not refundable.  

Bill,
Just playing the devil's advocate...If you bought a custom shirt and the stitching was bad or bought a custom boat and the engine was put off center would you
not want it returned? I guess I sometimes a handshake means a lot more than a contract.

After following this thread from the beginning, and re-reading it today, I'm a bit confused as to the negative comments towards the builder. It appears he offered to sell the banjo and refund the money, but instead sent back $1000 at the request of the buyer. Sounds like bhniko got what he requested.

However, after delivering the banjo, and getting glowing reports from the owner, 7 months elapse and all of a sudden, it's no good! Something doesn't add up. Tell me, if you bought a car, a custom shirt, or anything, and went back to the seller after 7 months because you were no longer happy with it, I doubt seriously you'd get a full refund. If the builder indeed offered to sell it and refund the money, the buyer should have allowed him to do just that and all would have been settled by now. No one seems to address the 7 month time frame here. I think a reasonable approval period expired long before that.

Think about it folks.  Correct me if I'm wrong, please, but that's what I'm reading here.

Edited by - fanofbanjo on 04/22/2012 16:05:40

quote:

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Originally posted by bhniko

Bill,
Just playing the devil's advocate...If you bought a custom shirt and the stitching was bad or bought a custom boat and the engine was put off center would you
not want it returned? I guess I sometimes a handshake means a lot more than a contract.

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Defects are one thing; buyer's remorse another.  But if a maker has made a bad bargain, he or she needs to stand by it and make it right--even if at a loss.  At least that's what I think, and I know contractors who've blown estimates on houses, and taken losses that would have bought 30 or more custom banjos.

I agree about the seven month thing. That doesn't cut it at all. You wouldn't  pay to have your house built or remodeled and then 7 months later get ahold of the contractor and tell him you weren't happy., You would tell him right away.

I know thta seven months seems like a long time, but some builders (such as Martin) have a limited lifetime warranty against manufacturing defects.

Yes, I agree, a builder should stand by their work if DEFECTS surface over time, but it appears we aren't looking at that scenario. If there were any defects (and no one here except the buyer and seller have had the opportunity to examine the banjo in person) I see no evidence the builder refused to make it right, nor was he given the opportunity to do so. This is a case of "I want my money back" after 7 months! From what I read, the instrument was exactly the same as the buyer received it when it was returned (except for the moved position marker). Nothing broke, fell off, or imploded.

If it was defective all along the work was bad and it should never have left the makers shop like that. Even if the buyer didn't notice till a later date. If the neck was out of alignment than it should have been fixed or the money should have been refunded in full. The builder didn't get only part of the banjo back, why should he only refund part of the purchase price?
I bought a neck recently, and the first thing the builder said was "how do you like how it looks?" It came out a little darker than he had planned because the finish spray gun had some junk in it and he had to add an extra coat. He then said " if you don't like it I will build you another one and keep this one" that was a commissioned neck and he stood behind it 100%. as it should be!!
'

Appreciate all your comments. Yes...my nose was bent a little out of shape in loosing in loosing the money but I sleep well at nights and no one any harm as there are lot of you banjo guys that are honorable and I thank you for that. And again have to thank BanjoHangout for a forum that we can all express our thoughts and legitimate concerns regarding the banjo.

quote:

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Originally posted by moparcolt

If it was defective all along the work was bad and it should never have left the makers shop like that. Even if the buyer didn't notice till a later date. If the neck was out of alignment than it should have been fixed or the money should have been refunded in full. The builder didn't get only part of the banjo back, why should he only refund part of the purchase price?
I bought a neck recently, and the first thing the builder said was "how do you like how it looks?" It came out a little darker than he had planned because the finish spray gun had some junk in it and he had to add an extra coat. He then said " if you don't like it I will build you another one and keep this one" that was a commissioned neck and he stood behind it 100%. as it should be!!
'

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 I agree with you  moparcolt but defective, bad work and misaligned neck do not apply to this scenario or I would never have let it leave my shop neither.  Please read over my original response more closely as I feel I've stated my case well and you may have overlooked some of the details.

The maker that made your neck did the right thing and I would have done the same.

The buyer in this instance was not interested in exploring other options of further modification or refund at eventual time of resale and instead requested a buy-back of 1,000.00 which was paid to him promptly.

In response please look at the photos of the neck alignment in the photos on my original post...it is misaligned and attached improperly to the rim. If Mr. Mercier states the neck would not left his shop if it was in this condition...why did he do it?

And then this comment from Mr. Mercier
"If I were to alter the alignment of the neck, this would force the bridge off center to the body. There are flaws with the banjo but they are visual rather than structural. These were likely a result of trying making a banjo within your given budget."

I did not remember ordering a flawed or 'budget banjo'. I can guarantee that I or anyone else in the banjo community can buy a superior and well constructed banjo for $1800.

Lower fret/string misalignment

Neck misalignment

Edited by - bhniko on 04/24/2012 11:54:54

Luke is a professional builder and restorer of stringed instruments with a nicely outfitted shop in rural eastern Ontario setting. He is pleasant, well-mannered, and competent. I recently had Luke do some work on my 1979 Stelling Whitestar. I was pleased with the results and the care he took with my banjo. Luke is careful. At one point during the repair, he was unsure how to proceed and took time to call Geoff Stelling to discuss the problem and what approach should be taken to fix it. I picked up my Stelling at his shop a week ago and took time to look at the banjos that he had for sale. I would be pleased to own any one of them. At the time, I did not know about the "heartbreak banjo." I do know that Luke's hand-made instruments tend to appreciate in value. I also understand the risks taken when commissioning instruments. I am not sure that I have added much to this thread other than to feel badly for the two individuals involved. I think if they had been able to meet each other personally, a more suitable solution may have been possible.

The two parties have reached an agreement. They may not be happy, but they should get on with their lives and stop prolonging their misery with the rest of us. I recommend closing this thread.

Yes, I agree. Thanks guys.

I also agree.

One last thing! Have a look at the distorted curve of the tension hoop at the cutout.

This might be something for all makers to watch for in future as you may end up with a surprise.

http://www.lukemercier.com/heartbreakbanjo.htm

bhniko and lukemercier agree, close this topic